Should gays be accepted by America?

[pheonix561 2080]

You pit of vipers.

You're also committing the fallacy of ad baculum. By insulting the opponent, you discard you're credibility.

Well, gosh.

you bucket of piranhas.

[Sahaqiel 1232]

Already said, pheonix.

Albion seems to have left the thread.

I guess he didn't exert himself enough.

Points in response to his response to my most recent response:

Your perfect God speaks through vessels your religion calls imperfect and tells you God's perfect words from their unworthy mouths? 'Cause you know, parents and pastors never lie.

It is cowardice because you fear death and your savior, and you will not turn your eyes to what you can see in plain sight. You know not that you have a righteous meaning, you only assume based on a bunch of ink manufactured by a greedy company printed on a book made of the dead creations of your God.

Sahaqiel

[pheonix561 2080]

you have been frequently committing the fallacy of ipse dixit. In Latin it means "he said so". So, just because somebody says something doesn't make it true.

well gosh, doesn't peter say in the bible marriage is sacred between a man and a woman?

I didn't say that that proved anything. It doesn't. But I believe and know the truth, so it doesn't really matter to me---

I thought mission was the main goal of christians?

you plane of snakes.

oh wait, he left? I wish I could have been more active in this debate. WHY MUST I SHARE MY COMPUTER WITH MY BROTHER?!

[Hare Krishna 0]

well gosh, doesn't peter say in the bible marriage is sacred between a man and a woman?

you plane of snakes.

oh wait, he left? I wish I could have been more active in this debate. WHY MUST I SHARE MY COMPUTER WITH MY BROTHER?!

hahahaha plane of snakes. everything he/she said was a "logical fallacy"

I think he/she committed sewercide. I'm gonna stay up for like 10 more minutes just incase they come back

[Max 10]

I was just starting to enjoy this =<

[pheonix561 2080]

I do follow Jesus' words. A.K.A. the Bible.

nope. thats the 1/6th at the end. the REAL stuff is the first 5/6ths.

Can you prove that God doesn't exist? No, therefore you can't say that either side is true, LOGICALLY.

HOLY CRAP LETS GO FSM!!!

[Max 10]

^ =D

[pheonix561 2080]

I did not say that because he's illogical he's above logic. I said he's above logic and that's that. He created logic and he has the right to obey it or not.

so your saying president clinton can say extra marital relations are wrong and immoral, and then he can go screw an intern?

OK GUYS. SCREW YOUR INTERNS. BIBLE SAYS ITS OK(but first you have to say its wrong. also, no shellfish).

seriously though, lets turn this into a flying spaghetti monster thread!

[Hare Krishna 0]

nope. thats the 1/6th at the end. the REAL stuff is the first 5/6ths.

HOLY CRAP LETS GO FSM!!!

o lololol

[Shadowknight 54]

Whoa, I missed a whole debate. But at the same time, I didn't miss anything, because it's the same debate that happens every time a new Christian comes into one of these discussions.

Just in case anyone cares, I want to clear up something from a few pages back. I place Christians and Christ followers in different categories because every week, when I go to church, I hear people cussing and insulting. They call themselves Christians. I led a church trip last summer, and two of my students got caught with drugs. They called themselves Christians. A group of Baptists started the website godhatesfags.com and then protested outside the funeral of a pastor (he was a freaking pastor! This one really gets me) who was preaching about the same kind of love and forgiveness I follow. They called themselves Christians. But you know what? That pastor who loved and welcomed everybody was a Christ follower. The founders of the Scum of the Earth church (which is meant for prostitutes, thiefs, and criminals, you know, those who really need the love of God), named that not because of the crowd it preaches too, but rather because we as humans are the scum of the Earth, were Christ followers. They reach out and really try to help people.

The word "Christian" is thrown around so much these days that it means nothing.

But yeah, love everybody, including homosexuals, regardless of whether or not you agree with them. And I don't mean to say that you love them, I mean to actually have compassion. Condemning someone does not show compassion.

[pheonix561 2080]

THEREYA puppyIN GO SHADOWKNIGHT!

I puppyIN LUV YA!

EVERYONE GETS INTA HEVIN, EVEN AETHIESTS!

though I'm still confused about satanists.

[Kitsune 0]

Awww I missed all the fanatics

Let's go to the nearest psychotic cult chapter and recruit some new ones!

But seriously: Is there a practical reason as to why Homosexuals should not be accepted?

[Chase 390]

That guy there just touched my penis and liked it? Just a practical reason. If everyone respects everyone else, there shouldn't be a problem. "Christians" have a hard time respecting gays, though.

[Kitsune 0]

@Lionheart:

While true, Christians have always had a hard time accepting or reforming to changing times, I do not believe that all Christians disrespect people with different sexuality.

Many pastors/clerics have on their own started preaching tolerance, that we are all children of god etc.

And in the end: Why should the regular man judge anyone else, if you truly believe in god, is it not God who should do the judging?

(it's not directed at you, but more of a rethorical question)

[Lethe Albion 7]

Sorry I disappointed you all. My internet turns off at 10 every night.

Anyway, no there aren't contradictions in the Bible. You provided a nice long list of apparent contradictions. In each example I see there is only one or two supposedly contradictory verses. And it's funny because that's how most "Christians" come about. As in, the people who persecute homosexuals and everything else. But do you ever wonder what the rest of that passage says? Or what the rest of the Bible says, for that matter? Because I've seen it happen plenty of times. People read it OUT OF CONTEXT. You can't just say it contradicts itself if you haven't looked at every passage concerning the topic.

And I already explained to you how He is above logic. He invented it and he can do what he will with it. It' just that simple.

Fine then, Hare Krishna, this is why, to the best of my understanding. God loves everyone and I'm sure He would like to help everyone and He'd love it if the world was perfect and there was no sin. But then again, he already tried that. It's called the Garden of Eden. He gave them one command and Eve was deceived, and Adam disobeyed. They got tossed out. Sin entered the world. Now, knowing that God is an omnipotent, all-knowing, all-caring God, and that He has a purpose for everything that happens, Adam sinning was just part of the plan. But he had a back-up plan for humans to be able to get into heaven. That was Jesus. And when He came to earth, he provided a way for humans to accept him and enter Heaven when they die. Now, when He left, he sent out the disciples to preach to people and gain more followers. So, as you can see, God used Jesus, a human at the time, and the rest of the HUMANS involved to bring about redemption for man-kind. So here He is using lesser vessels to bring about his will. Because, if he just went BAM!! and everything was perfect, what would be the point? Because God's ultimate purpose is bringing glory and honor to himself. Yes, I really said that. It's also hard to explain. But because of the great events that led to Jesus ultimate sacrifice, it brought glory and honor to God and will eternally reap him more glory and honor. Now, he does not "use" people in the sense that you are speaking of. He uses them to accomplish good. And He's not the one directly controlling everything, He just decided what would happen before it happened all at the beginning of time. And one of the main reasons God lets people suffer is because without suffering, there would be no repentance. Sin was brought into this world, and it ain't leavin' anytime soon. God let's these things happen sometimes to teach people lessons, or to further His ultimate plan. And it's not for us to know His plan, which is why not everything in this world quite makes sense. That's the beauty of faith. It doesn't have to make sense. But that's why it's great, because as a Christian, I know that God is always looking out for me and that everything that happens to me happens for a good reason. Because what happened when we touch a hot stove? We learn that hot things hurt us, and we have now learned a valuable lesson. God does the same thing in our lives today. I hope that explains the whole mystery a bit

And I didn't get the fallacies from Wikipedia. I got them from my logic book "Logos" which I used for learning introductory logic this year.

And Sahaqiel, why should I care whether I'm being ridiculed? Does matter if someone insults me a few times on earth when I get to spend eternity with God in Heaven? It kind of doesn't matter. And I don't expect you to understand what the burn of the Holy Spirit feels like since, obviously, you've never felt it before.

Phoenix561, I already explained in a previous post about the whole insult thing.

And yes, Sahaqiel, pastors and parents lie. They just don't lie a lot. Because they love me, there's no reason to tell me lies about their most firm of beliefs. And no, I don't instantly believe everything they say just because they said it. But almost every time they back it up by Scripture, which is definitive truth, so that's good enough for me.

And what is it that I can see in plain sight? I don't fear death. I'm going to Heaven and there's nothing anyone can do about it. And did you happen to know that the Bible is the most accurate document of it's time? As in, the archaeologists who discover 2000 year old manuscripts and there are non-Christian eyewitness reports of everything in the Bible. Oh yeah, that and somebody recently found the Ark on top of Mt. Arrarat. But either way, I believe it as truth and I've heard God speak to my heart. I can't expect you know what it feels like in any possible way. But that doesn't make it not true. Like I've said a million times already.

Yes Phoenix561 he does. But that's not why he's right. It's because he was inspired and filled with the Holy Spirit when he wrote those words. So in essence they came from God who is infallible.

Yes mission is our main goal. Why do you ask?

And though only 1 6th of the Bible is Jesus actually saying something, Jesus is God, and God is the one who through the Holy Spirit gave words to human men to write. So, yes, it's all Jesus/God's/the Holy Spirit's words.

And no, Clinton can't do anything he wants. He's a flawed human just like the rest of us. God can, however, since He's a perfect, infallible, all-powerful being.

And maybe I made a mistake by calling you guys a pit of vipers and white-washed tombs. That's God's call to make. Thank you, Kitsune.

Shadow Knight, I respect you greatly, but the simple fact is, Christian and Christ-follower is the same thing. You speak of people who say they're Christians as if they really are Christians. But the truth is that they're not. So Chrisitans is the same as Christ-follower. Christian means "of Christ". And anyone who does not act like they are "of Christ" and has not been transformed by the Holy Spririt is not a real Christian. End of story.

Hey, Sahaqiel, are you all right? 'Cause you've stopped using logic, I just got worried. You know, with you insulting me and my beliefs and all that, it didn't seem like your normal self. And I'm sorry if I've seemed to have that "holier-than-thou" attitude. I've never said even once that I'm better than any other human being. And I don't think I am. I'm a disgusting sinful creature just like everyone else. We all are. The only difference is that me and all the other true Christians are actually trying to please God. We still fail, but God helps us get back on our feet. And I hope you'll come to realize that to. But even still, I'm still praying for you.