LGBTQIA

[CaptinBenny 1]

So, at my college we have a group, called Q & A (Queers and Allies), that I am a regular member of. I recently have been spending alot of time with it's other members outside of the club discussing various topics and gaining lots of info. Since Hnet seems to be a pretty queer friendly enviornment I figured I'd get some good debate on some of the obsticals we as a group are dealing with and our different pros and cons on such.

Guess I'll start with this:

I am a gender queer, female or male pronoun using, pansexual. Gender queer (for thoughs who don't know) refers to someone that does not follow the general gender binary of girl female and masculine male. *These definitions are subject to debate depenig on a society's renditon of how a male and female should look/act/place in society. The pronoun thing refers to what you would like others to refer to you as. Most of the members in club prefer "they" and "them" pronouns while other female-bodied individuals chose "him" and "his" male pronouns. Cisgender is the term used to describe a person who identifies their pronouns as the same as their biological gender. So a male bodied person using "him" and "his" pronouns would be cisgendered (and vice versa) The pansexual bit is someone who's sexuality and attraction is based on personality rather than gender. *Keep in mind that gender and sex are COMPLETELY different things! We look at people for who they are rather than what they are.

(If anyone has questions don't be afraid to ask)

My question is: What is the difference between Bi-sexual and pansexual? I thought I knew what it was but OBVIOUSLY not. And no one in my club seems to be able to give me a straight answer on the subject. (no pun intended)

[Fierce Muffin 490]

Bisexual means you like both males and females equally. It also goes together with 14-year-old girls.

Pansexual means you don't care whether they're male or female since you're looking at their personality.

P. sure that's about it. Seems bisexuals are just whores while pansexuals are anime characters.

[Chase 390]

Just be a person. You're a person. This LBGT stuff is just trying to draw lines between people based on arbitrary differences that are just in a person's head.

This.

You notice how there aren't that many groups praising straight people? That's because everyone considers it normal. You're making being different "weird," which is the opposite of what you're trying to accomplish. Yeah, I get it, in the past gays, transexuals, etc were all hated and condemned. So were black people. We all moved on (except, perhaps ironically, the blacks) and only hate groups outright condemn anyone. Even so called "homophobic" people won't outright hurt you because of your sexual orientation or gender orientation or whatever. They just don't like you and/or your choices.

As a society, we accept different people. Gays are accepted. You don't have to make Gay/Straight alliances. Or rainbow groups. You want to know who's hated in our society? People that speak out against being gay.

For the record, he and she are both a lot more practical than your definitions, because

1) the majority of people can tell a person's sexuality with just a glance. If the person is man dressed as a woman and people call him a she, that's fine because that's what he wanted anyway.

2) you'll never get everyone to agree with you.

3) you're being complicated and complex for reasons only you will understand. No one else but your group "gets it."

[Sahaqiel 1232]

Well really the question was just what the definition of a bisexual and pansexual is, lol.

Label discussion:

But I agree with you guys. When I look at myself now, I sometimes worry that I'm too normal because I'm so comfortable in my own skin. I don't have any particular label I want to give myself, and I don't, but I know that society in general doesn't find me "normal". I wish people could all just be like yeah, we're all people. You're a person who wears a skirt. I'm a person who shaves his legs. You're a person with a beard. You have a hardwired disposition to same-sex relationships that you can't help and didn't choose. It's all good. If you have something particularly extraordinary about you, it's not because you hallucinate or overexaggerate symptoms that make you believe you're one way or the other to make something more interesting about you.

Unfortunately, society does, in fact, base their prejudices and sociological differences on arbitrary things. And for the most part, I have to accept that too. It's when people attempt to hurt others based on those differences where I draw the line. But when people are wearing their "burden" on their sleeves, it's more often than not for some form of attention. It's why being a "geek" is cool now, or why being an "otaku" is hip, rather than a debilitating reclusive behavior. Social stigmas against things that people coincidentally matched up with in some way and became attached to. Now you can be considered a "computer nerd" by staying on Facebook at all hours of the day. It's a way to feel special without having to do very much. Those aren't labels you give yourself. You do things naturally and then end up with them. Nobody ever sat down and said "I'm going to have asperger's today!" They acted like normal and then was given that diagnosis. Some people might call me a weeaboo because of my interest in anime and the Japanese language. I don't care. It's what I'm interested in, by my own designs. I don't try to label myself an "otaku" or anything. I watch a lot of anime and I independently study Japanese. I inadvertently earned a stigma, and I didn't let it get to me. Instead, if anything, I try to earn the label of a "good example". If I am considered a weeaboo, I want to be a good example of one. I don't have to act any different. I just have to be savvy and self-aware enough to make other people see it my way. I don't have to force it down their throats, I just have to act according to my own designs. Not the expectation people have of a "weeaboo". If you get what I mean. Like, my labels don't define me. I am who I am, and whatever label I have can be ignored, because we're all people when it gets down to it. A good example of any demographic being someone who acts like themselves, rather than letting society define what you do. Like if you are annoying, people would say "He's annoying because that's just how he is!" rather than "He's annoying because he's a weeaboo!"

Likewise the other way around, too. I would rather be praised because I am worthy of praise, rather than it being credited to how I'm Asian, or something.

Anyway, pretty much what Muffin said.

Bisexual

Pansexual

Pretty straightforward. LOL!

Sahaqiel

[Sahaqiel 1232]

That's p. true. I more blame human nature than anything. Earlier today though, someone complained that a grown man had slapped him in a fight, and he was taken aback, because he didn't expect to be slapped by a "grown man". That's when I said, "Your sociological expectations mean nothing in war!" because I think that's more appropriate than "Your nature of sorting things into categories with appropriate behaviors is what caused you to be taken aback, and that is why you left yourself open to further attack in the ruleless act of altercation!"

[Linkprow 42]

That's p. true. I more blame human nature than anything. Earlier today though, someone complained that a grown man had slapped him in a fight, and he was taken aback, because he didn't expect to be slapped by a "grown man". That's when I said, "Your sociological expectations mean nothing in war!" because I think that's more appropriate than "Your nature of sorting things into categories with appropriate behaviors is what caused you to be taken aback, and that is why you left yourself open to further attack in the ruleless act of altercation!"

The second one seems like it would be more fun to say though.

[Chimetals 344]

Bisexual means you like both males and females equally. It also goes together with 14-year-old girls.

P. sure that's about it. Seems bisexuals are just whores while pansexuals are anime characters.

welp, i must be a 14 year old girl-whore.

jkjk, i know what you mean, though. ive known people that changed their sexuality based on whether they were dating a dude or a chick, and it drove me nuts. not all bisexuals are like /that/ but FFFFFFFFF are there enough of them to give that rep.

imo, there are a lot more labels in circulation than are really needed or actually used......especially since several of them, imo, mean the same thing, and only the people defining themselves as one of those little-used labels really can tell the difference.

also, from where i stand, bisexual and pansexual are similar in that gender preference isnt much of a thing, but bisexual was most likely coined before the third gender business (im throwing out an educated guess here). also, i kainda do care what people look like. i dont expect some model or anything, as far as partners, but i can be turned off if i dont like how someone looks, its just in my taste, which is why im not gonna ID as a pansexual, because even if someone has a decent enough personality, it doesnt mean ill be attracted to them in that way, really.

*edit*

just doubly clarifying, im going off of the impressions ive had through my region of the world and the definitions people there have told me, not the wikipedia/urban dictionary versions, simply because if i can base my thoughts in experiences, i prefer to do so.

and i wanted to bring up something funny: when i first came here, i gave p much everyone the impression i was a guy, and i was perfectly content with that. if i came across as a dude, then so be it--whenever im presented with the choice in games, etc, i play male, its just how i roll. being a guy doesnt bother me in the slightest, nor does being thought of as one, referred to as one on the street when someone misIDs my sex, etc. but as soon as i was labeled here based on my sex, suddenly!female pronouns.

[CaptinBenny 1]

@ Tarou

well as i said above, and Saha confirmed with urban dictionary, pansexuality goes by GENDER not physical attractivness. Yes, a person's standards on attractive traits play a big part in it but gender does not.

And what I gathered from Urban dictionary is that bisexuals only see two genders which makes my previous asumption semi-correct in that it doesn't include gender benders, hermaphrodites, intersexuals, androgenous people, and those with sex-chromosome anomaly such as klinefelter syndrome or turner syndrome. Which any could still be physically attractive as well as socially and mentally.

[Sahaqiel 1232]

The UrbanDictionary page says that it doesn't really matter what a person is, as long as they're a good person (in his or her eyes). It doesn't matter if the person is a M->F or a hermaphrodite, because who cares.

2. Noun: A person who is sexually interested in other people regardless of gender including males, females, transexuals, tansvestites, gender benders, hermaphrodites, intersexuals, androgenous people, and those with sex-chromosome anomaly such as klinefelter syndrome or turner syndrome.

[CaptinBenny 1]

Exactly

[Chimetals 344]

And what I gathered from Urban dictionary is that bisexuals only see two genders which makes my previous assumption semi-correct in that it doesn't include gender benders, hermaphrodites, intersexuals, androgenous people, and those with sex-chromosome anomaly such as klinefelter syndrome or turner syndrome. Which any could still be physically attractive as well as socially and mentally.

The ability to reach down someone's pants and be satisfied with whatever you find.

look at the word, bisexual. it has "sex" in it, not "gender" and all those examples are written in and described in terms of X and Y. there isnt a chromosome V, there isnt a third sex, and gender orientation isnt a thing. and transgender isnt something that needs to be set in a third category for sexual attraction, because its something that people will or wont be ok with on a person to person basis, regardless of orientation. (although sex at birth being a factor at all is depressing, imo)

bisexuality covers the gene pool, and all its little variants.

[Teto 2609]

On this other site the pan/bi argument is pretty big. People are like "WELL I'M BISEXUAL AND I WOULD LIKE ANYBODY REGARDLESS OF ANYTHING THEREFORE PAN ISN'T REAL"

caps to represent the voice of all of them, there are a lot of them hence loud

Which I thought too, and then I realised half the bisexuals on that site are probably pansexual, which is why so many people are confused.

[Cirt 612]

Unrelated but:

guys this is one of the most "civil" and best serious discussions so far. no one jumping down each others' throats yay!

[Teto 2609]

WELL

IM OUT

[Sahaqiel 1232]

teto your arguments are weak and you just suck in general GET OUT OF THE FORUM