Homosexuality & Christians

[Gael 1]

I want to clarify something that's has bothered me for several year, something that I've finally found some closure to. It saddens me to see gay people being verbally and physically assaulted by people who call themselves Christians. This has led to a return of hostile feelings from much of the gay community, and I don't blame them. After some research that I should have done a long time ago, I've decided that the fear, hate, and condemnation of the gay community is unfounded. And those who want to continue such treatment need to either change their ways, or just stop calling themselves Christians, because they're failing miserably.

Verses from the Bible (I will be pulling from the English Standard Version) often quoted as proof that God condemns homosexuality are these:

Leviticus 18:22

"You shall not lie with a man as with a woman; it is abomination."

Leviticus 20:13

"If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

Literalist and Fundamentalist Christians do exactly what their names would suggest. They take every line of Scripture completely literally. They don't stop to consider the context in which the line was written. If you read up on it, you'll learn that the book of Leviticus is a guideline for how the ancient Israelite people were to live. Some have said that these guidelines were mainly for priests or holy men, but others have said that it was for all of the people. Regardless, this is why Leviticus has also been referred to as the Mosaic Code, or the Holiness Code.

But, the truth is, modern-day Christians follow very little of the Holiness Code of Leviticus. True, this chapter includes passages that prohibit incest, bestiality, and adultery (also found in the Ten Commandments). But there are passages that, if followed in the present day, would seem very strange. For example, these are some of Leviticus' other commands:

-Do not lie with a woman going through her menstrual cycle. A man who does so shall be isolated from his people.

-Do not harvest from the corners of a field

-Do not eat the fruit of a young tree

-Do not crossbreed livestock (*gasp* MULES! D:)

-Don't shave or cut your hair (I know a family of hippie Christians who actually do follow this.)

-Do not charge interest on a loan

-Do not wear clothes made from a blend of textiles (poly-cotton, cotton-wool, silk-cotton, etc.)

-Do not eat non-kosher foods (This includes pork, as well as shellfish like shrimp and oysters.)

Now, I think we can all agree that these rules, while they may have made sense to ancient peoples, really do nothing for us today. But why, out of all the passages in Leviticus, do people point to the passage forbidding homosexuality? That's what we call "cherry-picking" Scripture. It's choosing to follow only the commands in the Bible that are convenient, or that apply to other people (in this case, homosexuals). It also refers to using passages for your own ends while ignoring their historical & Biblical contexts.

My second point, which is very simple, but very important to me: Jesus never once said anything about homosexuality. He never condemned it, he never condoned it, he never said a single word about it. Jesus said many important things. If the Son of God did not see fit to discuss homosexuality, how important could it possibly have been? What Jesus did say was to love everyone. Let me repeat that. LOVE. EVERYONE.

The words and ways of Christ should be more important than the laws set out for ancient civilizations.

To be a Christian is to be a follower of Christ. If you are spreading hate, anger, and violence, then sorry, but you are not a Christian. Now, if you read the Bible, remember the context, but still feel in your heart that homosexuality is wrong, that's fine. They're your beliefs, and as long as you remember to love, and never to hate, then I've got no problem with you.

So, in conclusion? Love ya. ;P

[Max 10]

Love ya too ;>

[PrimaGaga 1025]

I saw this thread title and was like "Do we havta do this again?" I like what you said though.

I also enjoy this: http://www.homosexualeunuchsandthebible.com/index.html

[Chase 390]

Don't hit on me and I won't hit you.

Jared.

I don't hate homosexuals. I don't like the stereotypical homosexual (flirty attitude, high-pitched voice, very feminine) but I could care less who you get in bed with. I don't want to know your business. I'm not your wife/husband. If you need help, if you want to be my friend, fine. I like friends. I have some good homosexual friends. Just don't try anything.

[Jareddude 62]

Don't hit on me and I won't hit you.

Jared.

I don't hate homosexuals. I don't like the stereotypical homosexual (flirty attitude, high-pitched voice, very feminine) but I could care less who you get in bed with. I don't want to know your business. I'm not your wife/husband. If you need help, if you want to be my friend, fine. I like friends. I have some good homosexual friends. Just don't try anything.

? I wasn't even in the conversation yet.

And thank you for clearing this up Gael. This should be sent to the news or something. I'm serious.

[Cirt 612]

If this were Facebook, I would "like" this. :>

[randomfan 0]

I already do. Like it, that is. Here's another good essay by a man who considers himself a conservative Christian; and yet is quite in favor of gay marriage and ordination: http://www.covenantnetwork.org/sermon&papers/A/Achtemeier_M_Grace_Lead_Home.html

[Sahaqiel 1232]

I think GMP needs to get all up in here and read this.

[Jo-Bengt 0]

This made me want to stay. Seriously.

To be a Christian is to be a follower of Christ. If you are spreading hate, anger, and violence, then sorry, but you are not a Christian.

Thank you. Thank you so much. This is what I've thought for years, and what I want to tell every preacher or Christian who spreads hatred.

Amazing thread is amazing.

[Gael 1]

Oh, and another point I'd like to add. As far as Christians, go, we don't believe in sex outside of marriage. But there are many Christian gays who are in loving relationships who are also bound by this rule. (I'm not applying this to non-Christian gays because usually, if you're not a Christian, you're okay with pre-marital sex.) So, what do we do...?

Legalize same-sex marriage. Duh. We can't point fingers a gays for having (gay) sex outside of marriage if we won't let them marry.

Amazing thread is amazing.

That made me chuckle. Thanks. ;P

[Chase 390]

Live as a married person. That's essentially what we have to do.

[PrimaGaga 1025]

I love how you guys are generalizing Christians. I know a few Christians who puppy and aren't married. I just had to point that out.

[Sahaqiel 1232]

It's not generalization. It's just saying that a Christians' belief system tells them not to have premarital sex.

They could do it anyway, but that just means they're not following their belief system that well.

Sahaqiel

[Gael 1]

Yeah, man? Wanna show some sources, or did you just pull this out of nowhere?

You had a good thing going but your "one more thing" post was in over its head.

The Bible instructs Christians to not have sex with anyone who is not your husband or wife. I have never met a non-Christian who thought pre-marital sex was wrong. I'm sure they exist, but I've never come into contact with one. That's why I used the word "usually".

[Kaffles 17]

I have never met a non-Christian who thought pre-marital sex was wrong. I'm sure they exist, but I've never come into contact with one.

Most of my friends are atheist or agnostic

and most of us don't think pre-marital sex is right. I'm sure there are plenty of other people on this forum who are the same way too

Just because a person isn't religious doesn't mean they don't have morals